UPDATE: Dr Phil Show Aired Friday May 13 and we caught it here. The article below as written by me back in February. Today Anna and I watched the show along some EDC viewers on streaming video. We held a chat and video commentary before and after and will be posting that here on the website soon.
Dr Phil Mail Order Brides Show Disaster
Will it never end? Will every media spectacle about men marrying women from other countries be anything less than a showcase for worse-case-scenarios? Will they ever let go of the mail order bride label? I’m in mourning over this show – only because I had such high hopes that Dr. Phil would rise above it and “Get Real”.
Anna and I were guests in the front section of the audience fully prepared to participate in the show. The senior associate producer contacted us and began the process. We interviewed with three of their staff. We submitted all of the information they requested. We were coached that our part may not be long since there was no original plan for having a “successful couple” being represented in this segment on “Mail Order Brides”. That should have been my first clue pointing to where this was headed; but I still had hoped for better from Dr. Phil, based on his reputation.
However, his staff found extreme examples to parade on stage; re-enforcing the worst stereotypes. I shouldn’t really blame them. I’ve come to understand that controversy sells, and they have a job to do.
First to the stage was David. This guy was an over-the-top control freak. He tried controlling what his wife said – and even what Dr. Phil would say. Dr. Phil commented on stage that his behavior put him in the top 1/10th of 1% of extreme controllers that he’s ever had on his program. But the subconscious message was clear: guys who can’t find a woman to tolerate their horrible behavior go overseas to find subservient women.
Next up were two unattractive men in their mid 60’s. One of which appeared to be over 400 pounds! They were both defying the warnings of everyone around them by going on the hunt for hot young wives. The subtle message here was: losers who can’t find a woman at home go overseas.
Mark & Anna on the Dr Phil Show - Success stories get little air time.
All three of these men spent a lot of their air time bashing women at home. They repeatedly used exaggerated generalizations to demonize every female in North America. Come on guys – your mom would be included in that group. The message; bitter men go overseas to avoid their own issues.
The final element of the show detailed how the overweight guy had a previous marriage where his wife left him after he sold everything to pay for her lung transplant. The other guy in his 60’s had been tied up and robbed at gunpoint. The message here is that it’s a hostile environment outside of the US and people who leave will get what they deserve.
Anna and I had less than one minute and I said, “Dr. Phil, although I appreciate the entertainment value of what has been presented here, there are a vast majority of us who met our wives overseas are caring and devoted men.” Anna simply commented that we’ve been married for more than three years and that we’re very happy together. That was it and the show moved on. I’m not even sure if our comments will make it on the final edited version that hits the air.
You are my friends and I need to share this with you. I felt wounded by this episode. I think all good Catholics feel the same way when the media pounces on a priest who is accused of molesting a child. Most Catholics are good people. Most priests sacrifice their lives for a noble cause and never cause harm to anyone their entire lives. But they are all muddied by the association of these molestation stories.
I don’t know that we’ll ever get past the “Mail Order Bride” stigma or the stereotype – but I am not one to sit back and let the good couples stand idly by and just take the assault. I am so intensely motivated to find a way to come back swinging. I’m just not sure what I can do.
Perhaps someday someone will present an incredibly romantic story about a boy meets a girl from differing cultures and how their love survives all prejudices. Wait. I think that was Romeo and Juliet. I’m just going to have to write my own happy ending – and I hope you do too.
I know this if off topic but I’m looking into starting my own weblog and was curious what all is needed to get set up? I’m assuming having a blog like yours would cost a pretty penny? I’m not very internet smart so I’m not 100% sure. Any recommendations or advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks
Dr. Phil is NEVER going to expose the hypocritical and unfair nature of our dating “game”
on his show because it will anger his female audience. I hope to see him fall into this
discussion more ho nestly some day, since there are more 1000 “international
marriage” agencies and 6,000 such “mail order” marriages a year.
This program was ridiculous. I have been in Russia and Ukraine 3 times on my own, and never had the slightest problem. This guy who was robbed is a fool, this is eastern Europe where incomes are low and foreigners stand out. Guys, just learn to blend in and act cool, don’t run your mouth and flash cash around. I met a beautiful girl there and on my 3rd trip we were married, we are waiting now for her visa. A note of caution, people are basically the same anywhere you travel, and so if you have trouble getting along with people over here, you will have the same trouble there! People in Russia and Ukraine are serious people who have to work very hard for their money, respect the locals and you will be respected. Yes there are a LOT of beautiful women over there, it is not an exaggeration, you will be amazed actually. However, beauty can be skin deep and there are gold diggers, take your time to know the person.
Irina:
That was our point too when we did this video reply: http://youtu.be/Tr7Zs9oWiPk
But Dr. Phil is an AUTHORITY to so many people. Years from now there will be good hearted and sincere men who want to consider coming to other counties to find their spouse and the women in their life will say, “Well I saw this episode on Dr. Phil and . . . ”
Although you and I understand that this is just “Hollywood”, it does damage and further labels you as a Mail Order Bride. You do not deserve that label and neither does my wife. It may just be a “show”, but this is where millions of people get their information – and those same people have no interest in looking any further to learn the truth. The damage is done.
Ops, did NOT see)))))))))
Irina:
I never said his show “Lied”. The stories of the men and women were true. My objection is not that the stories were untrue, my objection is that they mis-represent us. Irina, if you had never known that people from America were able to go to Russia to find a wife and ALL you know was what you saw on this program then you would have to conclude that the men who go over there are control freaks, old, fat, and abusive. You would wonder if all of the women were not sincerely interested in love, but only wanted to take men’s money and the ones who were sincere would be beaten, left in the cold, and abandoned.
Even though these stories were true, they are RARE! Most of us are good loving people who wake up every day so glad to have found amazing love. The American men LOVE their Russian and Ukrainian wives! The wives LOVE their men and families. The true story of the VAST MAJORITY of us are wonderful and deserve to be seen in a good light.
The show yesterday made all of us look bad. It’s not that these poor people did not have sad stories. It is just that millions of viewers who knew nothing about us now think that we are stupid for our choices – and instead they SHOULD be amazed at how wonderful our relationships are.
How is your marriage?
I did see any “lies” in Dr. Phil’s show. I am a Russian woman, married to American (for 9 years). I agree to the show.
Oh did my phone blow up this afternoon. I took down my facebook page, and I have emptied my box. My sister …. You are going to end up DEAD!, My friend… Dude, I cant be in your wedding (I have known the guy for 30 years) the family has chimed in; Dont Go ! Dont get married to that ‘mail order bride’! 2 of my friends from ICE were all up in arms against it (even though we have worked many cases together)
Meh, Looks like the guest list just got ALOT lighter. I am going over there to work, I am going to spend 3-5 years there depending on the contract I get. I am going to meet my girl, have a proper courtship, a long engagement, and learn to know each others hearts. If she isnt the one; then I will heal my heart and keep searching, but I am not coming back to the American dating scene. I wont generalize about American women, other than none of them that I have met in the last five years will give me the time of day. They may have hearts of gold, I wouldn’t know because they wont engage in a conversation.
“But what if you die over there!” Then at least I will have an interesting obit.
(I did 15 years military analysis focusing on Soviet Russia and N.I.S, I think I know the risks pretty damn well)
Mark,
I just finished watching…so what! I am going because I want to find love and I know she is there. Dr. Phil does not know my life and what is best for me. God only knows who is best for me and I have not seen him do a one sided talk show, and honestly has written a best seller. So thanks to Mark, Rick, Anna, Peter, they have given me a way to follow my dreams, and with the grace of God, I hope that I will find my love.
As a coach of many years, I know that success breeds success. Let’s go guys and be real and honest and find our loves and with this success Mark and his company can breed success and other will hear our hearts.
Doug
I agree absolutely with what Brian McKenzie says. I went to meet a lady in China last week, and I was quite nervous about the fact that she could speak very little English, and I spoke no Chinese, however I was quite amazed at how well we managed to communicate by just taking the time to LISTEN and UNDERSTAND what each other was saying. We used an electronic translator quite a bit initially, but towards the end we hardly needed it at all.
I think the fact that we had to think carefully about what we said, and did not have the luxury of being able to be “witty” or “clever” made our communication infinitely more meaningful. I think this is also one of the many stereotypes – if she can’t speak English then she is inferior, because English is the only civilized language in the world!
Maybe this is one of the reasons dating in Australia and the US is more difficult than it needs to be – we have to get through the fog of witticisms and clever flirting before we actually get to communicate?
Personally, I couldn’t care less about the “mail order bride” stereotype – I think you will find that many men are just secretly jealous that you are married to a gorgeous young girl!
Peter! Welcome back from China, my friend! I’ve been curious to hear how your trip went. Please go to the Forum and give us a trip report in the European Romance Discussion section if you would (even if you didn’t go to Europe, we’d still love to hear your story). Can’t wait to hear all about it!
The language ‘barrier’ is not an a prohibition to success. If you take the time to LISTEN and HEAR and maybe have to even TRANSLATE what each other is saying, it causes you to be honest with your words, it forces you to participate in a conversation with meaning, and it should foster a learning together that will bond your hearts and intellect in a manner that you have never experienced. I say this as a linguist. Take the time, learn some of her language, learn her culture, take the time to introduce her to yours and be open, honest, sincere and direct with your communications. Yes there will be misunderstandings-they are bound to happen- but if you come at them both of your efforts from the side of patience and education (and yes sincerity and LOVE) you will overcome a faux pas. Everything that you have done before in America hasnt worked, because, and I am convinced, because of the American short attention span conversations, and the ellipsed preconceived notions that we will attached to a situation/conversation/or worse words unspoken. Challenge your mind set, everything you know about American dating, means nothing – do not bring your ‘baggage with you’ You should travel light, with carry-on luggage, and it should fit in the overhead bin.
I am not looking for a ‘Fairy Tale Happy Ending’ I want a life time of new beginnings, a full future of ‘Once Upon a Times’ . She is not a prize to win and show off – she is a heart to learn, love and grow towards. I wish us all the success that our hearts crave.
I was amongst the audience during this show, and witnessed some of the confusion of getting you two seated! I also now realize they failed to do a lot else- include you in the show! you actually had to jump in with the rest of the audience to put in you and your wife’s input on being a successful couple! I was extremely disappointed to see how Dr. Phil handled the situation and failed to bring important points to light.
Hell o Mark, I did not get a chance to watch Dr. Phil. But I assume you were not going to get a fair hearing.
Dr Phil is part of a long America male-bashing media industry, going back to Phil Donahue. In America, not only daytime television littered with this garage, we also have networks like “Lifetime” and “O” that broadcast male-bashing programming 24 hours a day. No wonder some many American women have little respect for American men. They are taught by the idiot box to hate us.
George Carlin once said that most feminists are women he would not want to have sex with. They same could be said about the type of women who spend their whole day watching talk shows. Even if someone is unemployed due to the bad ecomony, there are better things to with one’s time then watch talk shows all day. Last time I had a sick day from work, I watched the Science Channel most of the day.
You need to bypass daytime programs that are mostly watched by undesirable bitter American women. Maybe you should talk with the programming department at Spike TV.
As for how to get the word out that many-to-most foreign marriages are as affectionate and legitimate as yours, the web and YouTube are dangerous equalizers. A simple interview series on YouTube of American-Ukrainian/Russian couples would do more for this “cause” then all the words in the world.
People want to believe that it’s real, that you and Anna are real, but they’re too afraid of being wrong, of being laughed at, of being used. What would be immensely helpful would be an opportunity to watch some of these couples talking about themselves and their marriages, perhaps simply answering the same set of stock questions, proving that they really exist and that they’re really married, in all the right ways. It’s not about what they say, but how they say it.
Surely LA County has more such couples than you could ever meet, at least some of whom would love to help.
100% The Mainstream Media is dead they just don’t know it yet. Its old media and the majority of their user base is OLD as in Geriatric.
EDC needs to embrace new media. Use alternative outlets like Press TV, RT America, France 24 and others. You Tube is seen by many more than the major networks on a daily basis. USE IT! Get out there, interview couples, I couldn’t agree more! I know some enjoy their privacy but I know some like having 15 mins as well and its for a good cause, human happiness.
You don’t have to conduct long interviews, 5-10 mins is plenty of time to get yours and their’s point across. Also might I suggest you focus less on the men and more on the women, because we always hear from the men in these women’s lives but I’m sure hearing from women will put a more human face on the whole thing than horny, middle aged, fat and unattractive men chasing women half their age…
Dr. Phil never lets anyone smarter than him on his show cause then he would be outshined. He picks the worst of the crop to be on his show, making it trashy, almost like the Jerry Springer Show.
Mark, were you able to debunk the “mail order bride” myth this time? The media has got to stop using that term, since it is technically false in every way. They need to be educated. It’s like they have amnesia and keep repeating the same prejudices and stereotypes, even after they’ve been debunked with simple facts and common sense. That is why I have no respect for the mainstream media.
Winston
HappierAbroad.com
Mark
Great article…
I have strong feelings about this..
1st is, Many Americans are Arrogant and Ignorant about anything outside thier city limits, much less other countries.. The idea that eveyone is jealous of America and they only want to come to the Grand Ole USA, is one of the biggest ignorant statements of the century.. I have many friends from my travels that love their countries, and many do want to visit the USA, but they also want to visit Austalia, Europe, UK and other places.. Foriegners are much more experienced with traveling than Americans ever were… But, many Americans feel they know everything about foriegn countries..
One of the things that most people tell me in thier country is that they feel America is unsafe, and we generally have diferent prioritues than other cultures.. I’ve been told from many people that I’ve met in Colombia, although they have very few things, they are happy and feel they have rich lives with they’re families.. I found this to be true in my my experiences.
But, it’s clear that some would like to meet a man who is responsible and beleives in commitments. This is something that foriegners seem to beleive about American Men in Particular.. I don’t necessarily feel that is completely true.. There are many responsible Americans, but often that comes with other traits or characteristics that are less than desirable.. Americans are too tightly wound.. Learning to balance sense of responsiblity with some fun is an art of its own…
2nd – Many Ameicans feel women only want a green card.. I know that is possibly true with a few women.. But in General, and Simply and bluntly put, that opinion is just garbage.. There are more foriegn women or men that are good people and are simply looking for a decent partner.. The issue is with the cases of the scammers, is too often, men go looking for for the youngest hotest girl they can find and fall head over heals for the hotest girl in the club.. They overlook all the red flags and before you realize, they’ve proposed and started the visa paperwork.. I feel that part of the problem is the romance tours sell this as a single trip thing.. It’s just stupid to feel you can develop a relationship and sort out all the compatiblity issues in one or two trips.. I just don’t believe relationships can develope like that.. And when you have a language barrier, its even more niave to beleive that you can understand the fundamental elements of the relationship. The farse of “Language of Love” is for fairy tales only…
3rd – Many American Guys are Dogs.. Way too often, I’ve met men on these trips that go looking for a “quickie” or a “hookup” with a super hot girl.. They give the women a false sense and leave their hearts broken.. That’s an unfortunate side affect of any romance tour company as it’s not realistic to expect to weed out the dirtbags.
In general, I am friends with half dozen couples that have met either on a romance tour or simply while visiting a foreign country.. All of them are happy and the guys are reponsible men with good careers.. the wives are all in communication with each other.. My wife talks with these other girls by phone, and email, facebook and so on, almost daily.. I also comunicate with their husbands and have personal realtionships with them.. I simply dont know of any cases of abuse or other kinds of dysfuntionality that soo many beleive plagues these relationship..
I do however, have other friends, that are involved in those kinds of problems, but they are all Americans (wives and Husbands).. Maybe Dr Phil can portray them on the next show..
Kenny
WOW Kenny, don’ t hold back mate lol. Sad thing is I agree with almost everything you say. Americans have a very poor reputation outside their own country. As always are exceptions to the rule, I have a very good American friend and he is a fantastic guy, he even thinks Americans are ignorant. We see them as naive to the world around them. I classic example for me of this is American tv shows about being in another country, where they always say “Back to the world” meaning America is the world. All the rest is just a waste of space. Very close minded!!
Mark and Anna, my heart goes out to you both. A successful relationship makes crap tv but maybe it can be positive call for potential future brides to be careful in there choices.
Wishful thinking
Richard
You’d might as well link to the video of that Dr. Phil show, wherever it is. Let us watch for ourselves and see if we agree with you.
Hey, Craig:
The show has not aired yet, and this is actually a preliminary post – this was a share from my Facebook page. I have re-written a real blog that will be up shortly.
mark
Hey, Craig:
The real blog just went up.
Talk to you soon,
Mark
Mark!
Did I hear you say that American men can easily
protect their premarital assets AND the legal 50%
of assets gained during their marriages because the
foreign woman can be made to agree to accept $2,3,5
thousand for all her years of beauty, contribution, love
and sexuality…when you tell her/Lrey “It’s a heart connection
baby”
Prenuptial Agreements: Please don’t post this anonymously – this is a huge issue and close to my heart and I’d love to talk to you more about it.
YES, you are absolutely correct that a man can create a contract in advance to determine an amount his wife gets if they divorce. That is a statement of fact. I get many men who can’t get past the fear of being taken advantage of so they can contractually create a situation where they cannot lose.
Those are facts. Do you want to know what I PERSONALLY think about them? That is another story. I think prenuptial agreements are plans for failure and declarations of mistrust.
In my case, my wife asked if she could sign something to legally demonstrate to me that she wanted none of my money and would take nothing if we ever parted. Even then I did not do it.
I’d been married twice before. I decided that if I was going to do this again it was going to be unconditional – from the heart – nothing held back. Whatever we make together as a married couple is equally ours because that is how I see my marriage. Even now she tells me that if we ever parted ways that she would not want any money. We continue to declare our love for each other and make sure the other person knows that money has nothing to do with our commitment and love toward each other.
The existing laws already declare that whatever you owned before the date on the wedding certificate is your legal and separate property. There may be men of great wealth who should be smart about their ownership of a major corporation for the sake of control issue, then put your ownership of your assets prior to marriage in the name of a trust.
But I personally am not a big fan of asking your future wife to sign a prenuptial agreement. According to the laws that govern the creation and execution of prenuptial agreements a copy of this document must be drafted in her native language and explained to her by an attorney in her native language. There are strong messages of distrust communicated with the entire procedure that are not the kinds of things you want to be communicating right before your wedding day.
I do not think less of men who feel the need to use this document. I just think that they need be so clear in their communication to their future wife their reasons and that it does not take away from their unconditional love. The two messages are just hard to put together in one thought prior to a wedding day.
That’s just my opinion.